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Huaxiaosaurus is Freaking Huge by Fragillimus335 Huaxiaosaurus is Freaking Huge by Fragillimus335
Huaxiaosaurus is a massive new hadrosaur from China. A mounted composite skeleton measures 18.7 meters long.  At that size these Hadros probably outweighed most diplodocids, However the Chinese mounts seem to be oversized, and lengths exceeding 16m seem unlikely. To help grasp it's size, at its hip it is about the height of a small house.....

A kind little 1.7m SH rhino provides scale...

Note: Huaxiaosaurus is a real dinosaur, but it remains to be seen if it is a new species, or just a specimen of Shantungosaurus.
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:iconacepredator:
acepredator Featured By Owner May 15, 2015
I'd say big ornithopods were tyrannosaur destroyers in the way the very largest sauropods were carnosaur destroyers.
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner May 15, 2015  Hobbyist General Artist
I don't think they were tyrannosaur destroyers, but they definitely wouldn't have been a normal prey item for lone theropods.
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:iconacepredator:
acepredator Featured By Owner May 15, 2015
I don't think tyrannosaurs would even be capable of attacking something this size.
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner May 16, 2015  Hobbyist General Artist
Yeah, Huaxiaosaurus and shantungosaurus are kind of in a class of their own.
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:iconacepredator:
acepredator Featured By Owner May 16, 2015
This is an animal that only Saurophaganax or the giant carcharodontosaurs could hope to take on.
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:iconacepredator:
acepredator Featured By Owner Jan 8, 2015
Because herbivores have a carnivore vendetta.
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner Jan 8, 2015  Hobbyist General Artist
As they should!
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:iconacepredator:
acepredator Featured By Owner Jan 9, 2015
Ironically, if not for carnivores herbivores wouldn't have gotten to where they are.
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:icontraheripteryx:
Traheripteryx Featured By Owner Mar 1, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
Bigger, than the Berliner G. brancai? Oh, my! Even that was one of the most impressive mounted skeletons, I've ever seen! And when imagining this hadrosaur... Holy crap!
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner Mar 1, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
Well, as it turns out, probably not.  The Chinese mount was oversized and mis-proportioned. The real animal was probably 15-16 meters long and ~15 tons.  Still huge, but not Brachiosaur huge!
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:icontraheripteryx:
Traheripteryx Featured By Owner Mar 2, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
Yeah... would be a bit extraordinary.
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:iconteddyblackbear2040:
TeddyBlackBear2040 Featured By Owner Feb 3, 2014  Student Digital Artist
Wow did not know this creature existed
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner Feb 3, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
It's pretty new, and is probably just a Shantungosaurus.
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:iconnightxenon999:
NightXenon999 Featured By Owner Nov 28, 2014
Recently discovered.
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:iconron14:
Ron14 Featured By Owner Sep 24, 2013

That´s really a very nice drawing!

And possibly/probably quite realistic in size too, incredible as it may seem. What makes it even more amazing is the fact that the large specimen on which the species description was based (the one you mention, 18.7 m long) may not even have been full-grown, because its sacral vertebrae are not yet fused.

Did you know that huge tracks of giant duckbills have been found in coalmines in Utah and Colorado? Look for 'Dinosauropodes', especially the ichnospecies D. magrawii. You could call that one the duckbill equivalent of Ceratopsipes :-)

The longest distinct tracks are 1.36 m long (4.5 feet), with indistinct hints of some even bigger ones. Since the absolute minimum ratio of hip height to hind foot (pes) length is 4 and the average about 5.5 (the maximum about 6), this would indicate a hip height of at least 5.5 m (18 ft), more likely around 6.8 – 7.5 m (roughly 22 - 25 ft), possibly more. And that is height at the hips! That’s even pretty impressive for a sauropod!

I have been wondering whether maybe such giant duckbills arose in the absence of sauropods, filling that niche. In Late Cretaceous North America there was an (approx.) 30 million year absence known as the 'sauropod gap', until the latest Cretaceous (Maastrichtian, about last 5 million years), when there was Alamosaurus, possibly an invader from South America. Notable that the giant Sout American sauropod Puertasaurus is very Late Cretaceous, Maastrichtian. I am not sure, but there may have been a similar sauropod absence in Late Cretaceous (East) Asia. During this stage, there were giant duckbills in North America and East Asia, in the eastern US there was Hypsibema, in the west Lambeosaurus (Magnapaulia) laticaudus, possibly also very large Edmontosaurus. And of course the intriguing tracks. In East Asia there is Shantungosaurus (plus the two related mentioned species, possibly synonyms), possibly also Saurolophus and others.

BTW, according to latest insights Huaxiaosaurus is indeed probably Shantungosaurus, and Zhuchengosaurus as well.
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner Sep 24, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Thanks! :)

In regards to the Dinosauropodes tracks, I suspect a Shantungosaurus sized animal made them.  The foot to hip ratios of 5.5 could be accurate, but the Dinosauropodes tracks include a large "heel" that increases the length by almost 2 feet. The foot on the living animal was probably 80cm-1 meter long.  This indicates a 12-15 meter hadrosaur.
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:iconron14:
Ron14 Featured By Owner Sep 24, 2013

Finally, that looks like a white or square-lipped rhino, the largest rhino species. I have seen them up close (even touched one), I thought they were big.

Nice paleo-art, keep up the good work! When are you going to do Alamosaurus (I mean the really big ones, according to the latest discoveries), and B. nougaredi?

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:iconron14:
Ron14 Featured By Owner Sep 25, 2013
And I forgot to ask: since these duckbills, even the very big ones, could stand and walk on their hind legs, could you also show this giant in an upright position? That must be even more impressive!
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:iconshinyaquablueribbon:
ShinyAquaBlueRibbon Featured By Owner Sep 12, 2013  Student General Artist
D8 Wow. That's a big dinosaur. 
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner Sep 12, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
It might not be "quite" that big, chinese mounts are sometimes a bit sketchy!  Still, at least 15 meters long!
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:iconderdadort:
Derdadort Featured By Owner Aug 15, 2013
It's a pity that ornithopods are often underrated and seen as boring and defenceless herbivors. This guy must be a real behemoth and probably nothing a single tyrannosaur would deal with.
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner Aug 16, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Precisely!  The largest tyrannosaurs in it's environment were about 1/5 it's size... :0
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:iconderdadort:
Derdadort Featured By Owner Aug 16, 2013
1/5? What genus do you mean? I thought Zhuchengtyrannus lived also there?
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner Aug 16, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Yes, they could have coexisted, but old Zhucheng probably maxed out at about 9.5 meters long and ~3-4 metric tons.  Compared to the freakishly massive 17-19 meter, 20+ ton Huaxiaosaurus...
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:iconbaryminer:
BaryMiner Featured By Owner May 24, 2013  Student General Artist
I dont beleve this
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner May 24, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
I know right? It is absolutely huge for a non-sauropod dinosaur! These guys were at least 17 meters long an 18t in weight, and depending on how accurate the chinese mounts are, maybe 20m long and 25t!
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:iconbaryminer:
BaryMiner Featured By Owner May 24, 2013  Student General Artist
now maybe around trex size, but as big as a rhino?Thats just crazy
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:iconbaryminer:
BaryMiner Featured By Owner May 24, 2013  Student General Artist
I mean sauropod
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner May 24, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Oh, aha, I was confused at first! :) Still, adult Brachiosaurus would have been quite a bit bigger. It still blows my mind, but nearly every single sauropod skeleton in museums is a subadult or a juvenile!
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:iconsameerprehistorica:
SameerPrehistorica Featured By Owner Mar 30, 2013  Hobbyist
Nice drawing and i seriously don't like that any big Hadrosaur's hip is as tall as Brachiosaurus shoulder.But one thing for sure,no ceratopsian or Hadrosaurid is going to surpass the large Sauropods and i like it.Because i prefer some Sauropod to be the largest Dinosaur as well as the largest land animal that ever lived.
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner Mar 31, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
That is up for debate! There is a skeleton in China that is 18.7 meters long, and there are rumors of bigger ones! Huaxiaosaurus was about the weight of the mounted Giraffititan, but remember that it is only a "teenage" brachiosaur, and probably would have gotten 15% longer.
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:icontheropod1:
theropod1 Featured By Owner May 17, 2013
If it would have gotten 15% longer, which is pretty likely imo, that would make it 25m+ and 35-50t.
How large is the holotype of B altithorax? I think it was subadult too, From what I've heard there is no Brachiosaur known that has a fused scapulocoracoid. I also heard of a bigger specimen (~15% bigger I think) somewhere but I don't remember where and what it was.

This Hadrosaur is just enourmous. How long is its skull? It seems like it could be one of the largest among terrestrial animal.
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner May 17, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Yep, all mounted Brachios/Girrafis are not fully grown. The holotype of B. altithorax is roughly the same size as Giraffititan, but probably a tad heavier due to the longer torso.

I think the specimen you might be thinking of is HM XV2, a likely adult that is ~13% larger than the holotype. It is represented by a fibula.

The skull was probably ~2.1+ meters long, the scale bars in the paper are atrocious, but because it was likely just a big Shantungosaurus, scaling it up should give a pretty decent estimate.
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:icontheropod1:
theropod1 Featured By Owner May 21, 2013
HM XV2 is Giraffatitan/B. brancai
I tought there was some larger specimen of B. althithorax out there somewhere. It's kinda sad B. Althithorax is not so well documented.
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner May 21, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Oh, you want the real Brachiosaurs! :D Well everything is pretty scrappy, but there is one humerus that was tentatively assigned to Brachiosaurus that was measured as 213 cm long by Jensen. That is 213/204=~4.5% longer than the holotype. So, perhaps a ~25m/35 ton animal.
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:icontheropod1:
theropod1 Featured By Owner May 21, 2013
Is that the one that was on SVPOW some time ago? I'm subscribed to their feed, even tough I'm not that good at remembering things.
But I think it was really HM XV2 that I used back then, I remember it gave me a 28m animal. I think I read that on the Wikipedia-page before it was removed because it actually referred to a specimen of G. brancai. I must have assumed the holotype of B. althithorax was ~25m.
But I think it would really be somewhat longer than G. brancai (which is 22m), due to the longer torso and supposed longer tail, wouldn't it?
So the largest specimens we have of both were ~25m.
B. nougaredi seems gigantic tough, if it is really 60% bigger like Nima states, it could easily rival giant titanosaurs like Argentinosaurus.
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner May 21, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
No, I don't think so. It is quite obscure. Both the subadult holotypes are ~23 meters long, Giraffititan having the longer neck, and shorter torso, and Brachio being the opposite. HM XVII was probably ~26-27 meters long, and I assume adult Brachiosaurus were around the same size.

B. nougaredi was indeed huge. With a sacrum ~162cm long, that's a whopping 65% larger than the 23m Giraffititan holotype. If it had a long neck like Sauroposeidon, it was a good bit over 40m long, and weighed ~110t.
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:icontheropod1:
theropod1 Featured By Owner May 17, 2013
Thanks! Do you know some good sources for looking up sauropod specimens? something like the theropod database for example.

That's a damn huge skull, not as large as the largest ceratopsian skulls but it comes close.
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner May 17, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Nope, I just troll around SV-POW for most of my info, but theropods get all the love. Yeah, a giant skull for sure, only topped by aquatic stuff, Azhdarchids, and Ceratopsians, and possibly Amphicoelias!
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:iconsameerprehistorica:
SameerPrehistorica Featured By Owner Mar 31, 2013  Hobbyist
I did heard about that Brachio is a teenager from a Paleontologist.I use to think the skull for Brachio should be at least 3 feet.That is just my own thought.I did talked about this to him saying that i use to put its skull at 3 feet and i don't think that its skull will be less than 2 and half feet.Ive seen some other images where people put its head insanely smaller.Then he said that,its a teenager and its skull may be up to 3 feet and might be little more than that and i felt good hearing that.
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner Mar 31, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Yeah, the mounted Brach has a head about 2.3 feet long, and an adult probably had a skull ~2.7 feet long, which is pretty big for a sauropod!
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:iconsameerprehistorica:
SameerPrehistorica Featured By Owner Mar 31, 2013  Hobbyist
You should have seen a Drawing in the web of a Blue Whale with Brachiosaurus,T.Rex,Paraceratherium,African Elephant and a Human.That is the only drawing which has that comparison.Later a modified version came from that same artist.In that picture the overall the Brachiosaurus looks fine but its head is insanely small.I have seen some people doing that.
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:icontitanlizard:
titanlizard Featured By Owner Jan 21, 2013
The nightmare of a Tyrannosaur
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:iconpivotshadow:
PivotShadow Featured By Owner Jan 4, 2013
That's...that's big. Do you happen to know if it's the largest known hadrosaur? It wouldn't surprise me...
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner Jan 5, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
It sure is. It also happens to be the largest non-sauropod land animal ever to live, at least until we find something new!!!
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:iconstarstrike1:
starstrike1 Featured By Owner Dec 30, 2012  Student Traditional Artist
That's one big hadrosaur...awesome!!! I agree, it is probably closley related to Shantungosaurus....
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner Dec 30, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Closely related, if not the same thing!
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:iconstarstrike1:
starstrike1 Featured By Owner Dec 31, 2012  Student Traditional Artist
Yeah, it wouldn't suprise me at all!
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:iconsameerprehistorica:
SameerPrehistorica Featured By Owner Dec 17, 2012  Hobbyist
I use to wonder how these unimpressive looking Hadrosaurs became that huge.Anyway,Herbivores always outweigh carnivores.
Come on,it can't be bigger than a Brachiosaurus.
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:iconfragillimus335:
Fragillimus335 Featured By Owner Dec 18, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
It might have been, depending on how light you think Brachiosaurus was. I think their weights probably overlapped, but I'm just now remembering the Brachiosaurus we have is a subadult, so adult brachio's were probably ~10 tons heavier.
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